by abdullah
is it ok to do acupuncture while receiving homeopathy?
July 28, 2010 in by abdullah
A doctor says it is not good to have acupuncture while receiving homeopathy. Is this true?
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No, it is not true. Is the “doctor” a naturopath ?
Homeopathy is sheer nonsense however acupuncture can be efficacious. Go right ahead and get the acupuncture because homeopathy is the equivalent of placebos or sugar pills.
yes that dude is right
If a real doctor says so, ask him or her why.
First question…is this a real doctor? (ie, not a naturopath, osteopath, chiropractor etc)
Second…homeopathy is a bogus treatment (the recent Libel case with Simon Singh in England supported his use of the term “bogus” to describe chiropractic, so I feel free to use it to describe accupuncture or homeopathy without fear of being sued in Britian ).
Acupuncture is equally bogus. That is, there is no evidence that either acupuncture or homeopathy has any plausible mechanism, and no evidence that treatment with either of these modalities has affected the outcome of any real, objective illness, ever.
so…bottom line, it is ok…as both are useless, both are mostly harmless as well…even when used together.
No, you are not supposed to. It can interfere with the homeopathic action. But some homeopaths may say it’s okay.
Also, SkepDoc is being dishonest with you. The Simon Singh case he is referring to was in regards Simon’s use of the word bogus to describe some Chiropractic (NOT homeopathy) claims in an article. Simon argued that he was merely stating opinion, not fact (because if he was asserting opinion as fact, as the skeptics do here, he would have had to prove his claim, and since he could not, would have been guilty of libel)
EDIT- from Rhianna: @ Flashflood: You said, “It can interfere with the homeopathic action.”
OK…perhaps you could show us evidence of ANY homeopathic action? Thanks.
——- I answered the question and addressed an error by another. As I’ve said before, I’ve no interest in proving anything to the skeptics. The last time I checked, the title in this category was Alternative Medicine. There are no subtitles or clauses that say – “You must humor the skeptics first”
@Weise….A quick note on the Singh story. Notice how the burden of “proof” was on Singh?
Is there a name for mixing one placebo with another?
Find yourself a real doctor.
Neurology research at Harvard Medical school using high tech equipment have measured changes in DNA and the immune system as well as changes in the brain with acupuncture. Does not sound like a useless placebo does it? There should be problem with using both. DOMs use herbals along with the needles
### …not a jot..” better get in touch with Harvard research dudes and straighten them out oh wise one
edit: oops! not DNA but changes in gene expression, and molecular changes in nervous and immune expression, I have a good memory, it is just short. The link is:
http://nccam.nih.gov/news/newsletter/2010february
add: last part of link is 2010february. you will have to type into browser, too long to fit here. if it does not connect go to nccam site and locate the February newsletter
edit: as usual those of the pseudo ilk ignore research done in the past year or two and cling to the dogma
edit2: and R# you easily ignored the effect on gene expression and molecular changes in the immune and nervous systems. Typical. There was no claim about any specific disease made. This is early research by professionals. Enough to silence the “bunk” “woo woo” garbage if you are open to new information.
At least you checked the link!!
Argue with the Neurologists who published their work, not me.
I’m with Gary. Both are mumbo jumbo mixed with placebo. There may be some merit in in acupuncture in that it may cause the release of endorphins (having needles stuck into you). Neither have a jot of evidence that they work in the way they say and for homoeopathy there is none at all.
Homeopathy is worthless. Since it is impossible to interfere with the placebo effect, you will be fine.
Although you should know acupuncture has never been shown to have any benefit in a controlled experiment, so you are wasting your money.
The doctor who told you this was an idiot and probably not a real doctor.
Edit: Flashflood, homeopathy is bogus. That is cold, hard fact. Deal with it.
Both are placebo and I challenge anyone to find any good peer review research that says otherwise. You need to get a new Doc. Fretochose could you please post a link to the research which found sticking needles in someone can change dna sequences as if true this would be one of the greatest medical discoveries in history.
Homeopathy is hooey. You can take it with anything and it won’t interfere because it does nothing.
The only effect acupuncture has ever shown is a very mild, only slightly better than placebo, effect against back pain. So if your back hurts, and you’ve tried exercise, painkillers, and physical therapy, then acupuncture could be the last stop before surgery.
It won’t make any difference… neither have any convincing measurable effect to begin with. Homoeopathy is pretty clear cut, it’s never been demonstrated to work in high quality trials and there is no rational reason why it should work either.
Acupuncture is based on a traditional Chinese philosophy that health is dependent on the body’s motivating energy called ‘qi’ moving through a series of meridians beneath the skin. This of course has no factual, rational or indeed scientific basis. It is a metaphysical concept.
Like homoeopathy, acupuncture is at last being seriously questioned and rejected by the scientific community. It has most of its devotees among those with the vaguer and ill defined symptoms, rather than those with specific disease entities. Subjective issues such as pain and nausea etc, have always been soft targets for alternative therapies and it is here where they appear to have most effect. It has been suggested that acupuncture triggers endorphin release, (the body’s natural morphine analogue,) in much the same way as exercise and in this induces a feeling of well-being. It is possible that needle sticks may do this.
The most common ailment acupuncture is used for is probably back pain; but in a meta-analysis NOTHING came out very effective in dealing with back pain. It did not matter whether you saw a GP, a physiotherapist, an acupuncturist, an orthopaedic surgeon an osteopath, a chiropractor or a faith healer etc, more or less the same percentage of patients got better over time anyway.
However, 2 double blind cross over studies showed that these random needle sticks had an exactly analogous placebo effect, around 70% to ‘correctly’ administered acupuncture for pain. This 70% is a classic figure, given for placebo effect in pain relief and would suggest that acupuncture itself has no additional effect above and beyond placebo.
To suggest as the ‘Alties’ that just because something has been around a long time it must work is a nebulous argument. Tradition in no way guarantees efficacy. However, there is no doubt that it contributes to the ‘power’ of the placebo effect as does of course the large amount of theatrics involved.
Even used as a placebo acupuncture is not without risk. In the late 90′s a systematic review showed that there were documented cases of deaths after acupuncture, some due to septicaemia, cardiac tamponade and one induced an acute asthmatic attack. Also there have been cases of infections such as hepatitis B, HIV and sub-acute bacterial endocarditis and spinal cord injury. Its fallacious to list the negatives without listing the benefits, but in this situation, where there are no demonstrated benefits, it just leaves you with the negatives..
Conclusion? Don’t waste your money Conventional medicine unquestionably has its limitations, but at least it is increasing based on rational study and reproducible results.
======================================
EDIT
@ Flashflood: You said, “It can interfere with the homeopathic action.”
OK…perhaps you could show us evidence of ANY homeopathic action? Thanks.
======================================
EDIT
@ Frecotose: I’ve had a look at the link you are referring to. You need to go back and read that link. Basically, there is no evidence that acupuncture alters the course of any specific disease. As I stated in my answer, both pain and nausea are very subjective experiences, unique to each individual. I also mentioned the plausible theory that needle stick insertion placed near nerve endings triggers endorphin release, (the body’s natural morphine analogue,) which can induce a feeling of well-being. Where you get mixed up, is that you don’t appreciate the placebo effect. The placebo effect has a scientific, biochemical explanation. It is a real physiological effect, not just wishful thinking.
Acupuncture has not been demonstrated to work for any specific disease. At best, NCCAM are suggesting more research is warranted in this area. You can’t just make crap up as you go along.
Acupuncture is based on an ancient homuncular theory which has been discredited.
It even says in that article, “But these clinical outcomes may involve more than acupoints and needles. Other aspects of the acupuncture experience may play important roles in healing, including reassurance provided by the practitioner, expectation of benefit, and the sensory experience elicited by acupuncture…”
Yes, this style of perceived mysticism boosts the placebo effect even more.
The ‘doctor’ probably said it as they don’t want you spending your money elsewhere!
Both are effectively useless. Certainly there’s not a jot of evidence that doing both together could have any effect on each other, that’s just ridiculous!
Probably the most expert opinion you could get would be from Dr. Luc de Schepper, who has a doctorate in Acupuncture, numerous degrees in Homeopathy,is an MD, as well as having written numerous books on both subjects. If there was a valid reason for not having acupuncture treatments at the same time it would be because your Homeopath needs to be able to evaluate the effects of the homeopathic remedy on its own, and throwing acupuncture into your situation can make it difficult or impossible to tell what’s going on with your symptoms.
Check out Dr. Luc’s website.
Just go with what makes you feel better. The key is persistence, & being tuned to your own body, & keep questioning the doctor if what you went for is not resolved. Don/t believe him if you don’t feel the symptoms resolved, but he says you are ok. I have read all the comments, all 14 of them. I feel they are just made by a certain kinds of people, those who pretend to know everything, those who think that there can be nothing more than what they know. And there are others who will have you believe that if they don’t know it, it cannot exist. I want you to ask all of them, what is their qualification. Are they qualified Homeopaths, or naturopaths, or even have the rudimentary knowledge of herbals or Ayurveda? I want to see one health problem that the modern medicine has solved, healed. All they do is manage symptoms. you stop going to them, you stop feeling better. I am personally a believer in all the other systems of healing. The problems are every where, do you have no evil doctors? In fact all these people are in the category of quacks too, for they have no knowledge of the systems they are ranting against. I can personally vouch for Ayurveda, Homeopathy, Herbal medicine. I don’t have much faith in Allopathy, not because of some prejudice, but because of my personal experiences both as a patient & a provider. There is use for all. There attitude is “My way or the highway”. They are ranting because a lot of people have moved from them to rediscover what these allopaths had buried alive to make the big bucks for themselves. As for mixing Homeopathy & acupuncture, & don’t see any problems there too.was it an acupuncturist who told you that? Did you check with a homeopath about this? If not, then how could a person with his conflict of interest give you the right advice? Ever believed that you needed to use only wood to build your house, it would be devastating to use glass & steel along with the wood?
This has to do with your gut feeling. Don’t underestimate your own ability to decide what is good for you.
Just shut out all these vile noises & spend some quiet time with yourself to figure out what YOU want to do, not what the “EXPERTS” want you to do. They are very good at enticing the vulnerable. You are just scared & concerned, not stupid as they are making you look like. The closest thing I can compare their rhetoric is to that of the evangelists.
Ah yes, the burden of proof thing, don’t you see all around you, the burden of proof is always on the victim, & who goes scot free? the criminal, who then goes around ranting against the victim.